Curse

fs452 · Feb 08, 2006, 05:11 AM // 05:11

Hi this is my first post so it may seem long. I sadly have a Dell Dem. 3000

with a 2.4gh celron d. I want to play Guild Wars and I am stuck. Do i get Radeon 9250/Geforce FX5500 + an extra stick of 512 RAM. Or use my CPU get a new mobo with a AGP/PCI Express slot. I would like to play diffrent games like FPS or other MMORPGS in the future maybe. I am realy wanting to get into these games and out of the consoles. I would get a new computer but I will not have the funds for at least a year. Thanks for any help you can give me.

Markaedw · Feb 08, 2006, 06:26 AM // 06:26

I think your dell is fine, get a high meg vid card and the memory. I run guild wars off my laptop 1.72 intell with 1 gig memery, so what you want to do is boost the vid card to at least 256 and you should be fine, we're talking $200 at the most.

Kaguya · Feb 08, 2006, 06:29 AM // 06:29

2.4GHz is pretty fast for a proc, even tho it's a Celeron. Not familiar with Dell boxes other than the latest ones as our contractor changed to Dell this year, but I assume your current vidcard is integrated Intel chip?

Plugging in an AGP card (I assume the Dell has a slot

) should be a massive performance boost.

If you currently have only 512MB ram, I would upgrade it to 1024MB as well, atleast I have seen the speed boost it gives, although not as much as stuffing in that vidcard.

Depends on your budget, I'd prioritize in AGP vidcard, followed by RAM.

SaucE · Feb 08, 2006, 11:58 AM // 11:58

Quote:

Originally Posted by Markaedw

I think your dell is fine, get a high meg vid card and the memory. I run guild wars off my laptop 1.72 intell with 1 gig memery, so what you want to do is boost the vid card to at least 256 and you should be fine, we're talking $200 at the most.

A 128MB Video card is plenty. I would put the money into a video card with 128MB and a better series GPU then a lower grade GPU and 256MB.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fs452

Hi this is my first post so it may seem long. I sadly have a Dell Dem. 3000 with a 2.4gh celron d. I want to play Guild Wars and I am stuck. Do i get Radeon 9250/Geforce FX5500 + an extra stick of 512 RAM. Or use my CPU get a new mobo with a AGP/PCI Express slot. I would like to play diffrent games like FPS or other MMORPGS in the future maybe. I am realy wanting to get into these games and out of the consoles. I would get a new computer but I will not have the funds for at least a year. Thanks for any help you can give me.

Unfortunately, you will need to buy a new motherboard, power supply, and case if you want to upgrade to AGP/PCI-X (Dell case will only house Dell Motherboards, so a new motherboard and case will be neeed. Dell power supplies used to be designed to work only with a dell motherboard, not sure if that is stillthe case.) I looked up the model Dell you mentioned, and it does not come with an AGP slot (Another reason to get a new motherboard). If you decide to go PCI-X, you may have to get a new processor as well.

You can probably get a case, power supply, motherboard for under $200 easy. Then try to find a decent video card. 512MB of RAM is all you need. Get more if you usually run programs in the background while playing.

Hope this helps.

Old Dood · Feb 08, 2006, 12:05 PM // 12:05

Double check your ram. I am typing at work on our Dim 3000 2.4Ghz w/512Mb of ram myself. Dimm 3000's have only two ram slots and Dell is good at filling those slots with the lowest ram stick possible. This one has 2x256Mb sticks. My guess so does yours. So you would have to buy all new sticks to increase your ram. Go to www.crucial.com and run the system checker and you will know for sure.

Nothing against the poster above me...but be warned. Dell's do not like to be upgraded like that. They are fussy about it. You are better off buying a whole new system then trying to make a Dim 3000 a true game box. They were not designed for it...they are business machines...plain and simple. This is why I bought it for work. Its' main job is being a UPS Shipping computer...perfect for that.

fs452 · Feb 08, 2006, 10:34 PM // 22:34

So what graphics card do I get for now to play GW. I dont want to wait a year to play.

Nazo · Feb 08, 2006, 11:53 PM // 23:53

Of those two, I'd say get the Geforce FX 5500. It's better, even if it does still suck. It's all pretty low end, I'd say see if you can't find some used 9600 Pro or something out there or even a 9800 Pro due to it's incredible popularity. You may even find a 6600 series card for cheap enough, and those are pretty good (6200 is not.)

DO NOT, I REPEAT, DO NOT buy a 256MB video card in your pricerange. I repeat again, DO NOT. 256MB is a marketing trick. It will raise your performance by 5% tops, and I doubt you'll see that much. Video cards in that range do not have the power to handle the type of graphics that would require more memory, so there is very little advantage to it. As has been mentioned before, a better GPU will benefit you far more. Even in high end video cards more memory doesn't have nearly the effect that people seem to think it does. It helps, and sometimes is needed, but, not nearly so much as a good GPU.

Loviatar · Feb 09, 2006, 12:01 AM // 00:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by fs452

So what graphics card do I get for now to play GW. I dont want to wait a year to play.

here are some choices for a PCI (regular) slot

good company (newegg.com)

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...e= &maxPrice=

Nazo · Feb 09, 2006, 12:37 AM // 00:37

Ouch. No AGP? Yikes. Updating to an AGP board would be a good idea.
Last I looked, the most tolerable PCI video card that humans could afford was the so called "Bloody Monster." I think it was a 5600 Ultra. DO NOT BUY A GEFORCE MX, I WILL PERSONALLY HUNT YOU DOWN. d-: Seriously though, nVidia really has screwed a lot of people over and you'd be amazed at the sheer volume of topics in all the forums out there where people come in to ask why so-and-so won't run just to find out that it's because nVidia sold them a chip that can't do any pixel shader beyond DOT3 type shadowing.

You really need to upgrade to AGP if you have PCI. I strongly recommend that you hold off on this upgrade if you do and save up. Grab an AGP motherboard and a tolerable video card together. PCI is going to have a lot of slowdowns and even jerk or pause whenever things have to load data to the card's memory. Unreal engine games are practically the only ones out there that can avoid this issue by loading as much data as they can before actual gameplay starts. PCI just wasn't meant for such high bandwidth low latency data. I recommend only getting PCI video cards for backup purposes and for systems that absolutely cannot be changed (such as a server.)

BTW, VIA's AGP/PCI-E combo board that can supposedly do both uses a trick that essentially demotes AGP down to PCI mode. I recommend avoiding these. There's a new board by a company who's name I've forgotten off the top of my head (not SiS) which actually gets real AGP 8x performance from it's AGP/PCI-E combo board, but, last I checked the only one out was a very cheap board with no options (couldn't even change memory voltage...)

Oh, and Newegg is a good company. Best one I know of, though ZipZoomFly rarely has a deal that can at least come close to Newegg's. Don't buy from people like BestBuy, Office Depot, Staples, and other major brick & mortar places like those they overcharge because they can get away with it. I once stepped into a Staples and stood in an aisle with my mouth just hanging open starting at a case in sheer surprise at the sight of an ancient dust-covered 9600 non-pro selling for $100 more than a 9800 Pro on newegg sold at the same time. Well, really they usually don't do that. Just charge a good $100 more for a card than you can get on newegg.

JediKnight · Feb 09, 2006, 02:02 PM // 14:02

I have a Dell Inspiron 1200 and play with hardly any problems at all.

These are my system specs:

Time of this report: 2/9/2006, 13:57:37
Operating System: Windows XP Home Edition (5.1, Build 2600) Service Pack 2
System Manufacturer: Dell Inc.
System Model: Inspiron 1200
Processor: Intel(R) Celeron(R) M processor 1.30GHz
Memory: 760MB RAM
Page File: 261MB used, 1594MB available

Just to show that you do not need the most powerful computer to run Guild Wars.

Josh · Feb 09, 2006, 04:15 PM // 16:15

^^ Everything but your Graphics Card...lol.

JediKnight · Feb 09, 2006, 04:34 PM // 16:34

Oopsy doodle.

Graphics specs:

---------------
Display Devices
---------------
Card name: Mobile Intel(R) 915GM/GMS,910GML Express Chipset Family
Manufacturer: Intel Corporation
Chip type: Mobile Intel(R) 915GM/GMS,910GML Express Chipset Controller
DAC type: Internal
Display Memory: 128.0 MB
Current Mode: 1024 x 768 (32 bit) (60Hz)

Geez I thought I had way less Graphics memory than that, Can this be right for an integrated card?????

Josh · Feb 09, 2006, 04:36 PM // 16:36

That's fine, same as my ATI Sapphire Radeon 9250, lol. 128MB.

Nazo · Feb 09, 2006, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Bah, Intel GPUs suck. This game doesn't have terribly high requirements or you'd be in trouble. In many games they cause a lot of graphical anamolys and such and in all of them they underperform a real video card (I don't consider the 9200 or 9250 to be real though, they were just cheap things ATI made to sell a few more cards quite frankly. Had to compete with that horrid GFFX 5200 after all.) Actually, it could be it can't do certain things requiring higher level pixel shaders or something so those features are disabled and let it run faster (for example, do you see the HDR effect? No, that doesn't require PS 3.0 or I wouldn't see it, but, it does require more advanced PS 2.0.)

Either way, it may be just fine for Guild Wars, but, I recommend that prospective buyers look into real cards by the companies who know about graphics (which tend to be multi-data) rather than the company that specializes in primarily single-data CPUs (yes, they bought the ARM and have been working on it a bit, but, they don't specialize at all, and, besides, that's still a few steps away from real graphics.) Well, regardless, releasing that shared memory of an onboard card will help any game, including Guild Wars.

All that said, people seem to think they need powerful CPUs for gaming for some reason. I'm not really sure what propogates this theory other than maybe the fact that a slow CPU will limit graphics a bit so that the most powerful video cards will barely perform above a cheap one if your CPU is an absolute peice of junk (in other words, if you take an original P4 1.4GHz and slap a Geforce 7800 in it, you really won't see too much more versus, say a Geforce 6800, which one wouldn't normally expect considering the much higher specs and benchmarks of a 7800.) That's an upper limitation on maximum capabilities, but, it doesn't affect more low end things. I still see a shocking number of modern games that actually say they only require a Pentium 3 750 or better CPU. As for memory, XP has hefty requirements and will run many games poorly on a system with less than 512MB, but, hit 512MB and most games should get by. So, in the end, video cards tend to be the first and biggest bottleneck to concentrate on.

Oh, and forget video card memory. Just ignore it. Only a few cards really make a huge difference from higher amounts of VRAM. Most have a tiny difference. Yes, there is technically a positive difference with more VRAM, but, it's minimal and not worth the cost. Plus a few rare cases (such as the GF4 Ti4200 in the not so recent past) actually put faster memory on the card that has less of it. Lol, ok, a few less rare ones like the 6800 nu/le have slower memory versus the GT/Ultra.

Don't buy anything with "SE" at the end of it. Special Edition translates to el-cheapo "Sucky Edition."

Old Dood · Feb 10, 2006, 12:47 AM // 00:47

Still...he needs a regular PCI vid card. I would suggest looking up a few different models and the "Googling" some reviews. It will spice up that Dim 3000 quite a bit.

Nazo · Feb 10, 2006, 12:56 AM // 00:56

Can't beat newegg for this. Here's a good one to look at:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...2E16814139166R
Here's the search that narrows it down to just PCI video cards:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...e= &maxPrice=

I'd say the next best thing would be a 5500 maybe. LE means about the same thing as SE, so that 5700 is a weakened 5700, but, it should be about even with a 5500 Ultra I think maybe (hard to say for sure.) Those are plain 5500s so I think they are slightly worse than the 5700LE. I'm not 100% sure exactly where the 9250 stands, but, I know from personal experience that the 9200 line is pretty pitiful and the extra 50 mainly means it's a completely different core weakened down to the point it's roughly a 9200, just with one or two new features the 9200 line lacks.

Problem is, they just don't put many good GPUs on a PCI card for obvious reasons. About the only thing that's better would be those really high end cards like the Quadro, which are made for CAD and won't perform THAT much better at gaming. I can't remember what the quadros were equivalent to, but, I think that a quadro 4 should be better than a 5700LE if you can afford it, but, if you have that kind of money, buy a better motherboard and get a real video card.